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[sheila19624]

On July 4, Amazon spammed its customers with advertisement of Norman Finkelstein's virulently anti-Semitic book, Image and Reality of the Israeli-Palestine Conflict. On May 30, Amazon similarly advertised Beyond Chutzpah: on the Misuse of Anti-Semitism and the Abuse of History. I have never received any other ad from Amazon.

On April 4, in an unprecedented move, Amazon deleted all reviews of Obadiah Shoher's Samson Blinded: A Machiavellian Perspective on the Middle East Conflict. A few days later, Amazon forced its subsidiary Booksurge to terminate publishing contract with Shoher whose book is now available for download from www.samsonblinded.info . Google earlier banned advertising of the Samson Blinded for "unacceptable content." Shoher, indeed, is pro-Israeli, yet realistic and critical of Israeli policies.

Obadiah Shoher, an anonymous politician, abandons myths and moralizing in favor of realpolitik. He argues for raw efficiency of antiterrorist operations and shedding liberal idealism. Shoher asks inconvenient questions and gives honest answers. Amazon does not like that. Anti-Semitic lampoons by Norman Finkelstein are more to Amazon's taste.

[mtrmsd]

I've read some of Norman Finkelstein's work and don't believe he is anti-Semitic. There is a trend in calling anyone who criticizes Israeli foreign policy and policies toward the Palestinians anti-Semitic. Essentially, I think the post above is ridiculous.

[mtrmsd]

I usually don't respond when someone doesn't register. It is usually a hit and run comment and they are never heard from again. Having said that, I am interested in your comments about Finkelstein.

Like his close friend and mentor Noam Chomsky, Norman Finkelstein is not one to mince his words. In his eyes the mainstream Jewish organisations are 'hucksters', 'gangsters' and 'crooks'; Elie Wiesel (celebrity Holocaust survivor) is the 'resident clown' for the Holocaust 'circus'; reparations claims against Germany for Nazi era slave laborers are 'blackmail'; and he infamously dismissed Professor Goldhagen's critically acclaimed Holocaust bestseller 'Hitler's Willing Executioners' as the 'pornography of violence'. Small wonder then that he has few friends amongst the American Jewish establishment.

Shortly after the publication of Alan Dershowitz's 2003 book The Case for Israel, Norman Finkelstein accused Dershowitz, of "fraud, falsification, plagiarism and nonsense." Following Dershowitz's counter-complaints about Finkelstein's charges of plagiarism being unwarranted, Harvard University President Derek Bok investigated them at the request of the Law School's dean, Elena Kagan, resulting in Harvard's complete exoneration of Dershowitz.

I agree it is hard for a Jew to be anti-semitic but Finkelstein comes as close as your going to get. I suggest you read more from him and his buddy Chomsky.

http://www.chomsky.info/debates/20020530.htm

While I can't say I know enough of Finkelstein's work to fully support him (and I don't think I would), I simply wanted to point out that it's becoming common to label critics of Israeli policy anti-Semitic to scare people from actual discussion and discredit those with actual concerns. I wasn't trying to argue that Jew can or cannot be anti-Semitic.

I plan (whenever I get free time) to read more of Finkelstein's work. I am well aware of Professor Chomsky's work and am actually in contact with him, arranging a speaking event.

Your post has been informative on Finkelstein's controversial points and I found this interesting piece on Finkelstein's website in regards to Wiesel:

In the meantime, dismissing criticism of Israeli atrocities as driven by anti-Semitism, Holocaust Industry CEO Elie Wiesel lent unconditional support to Israel - "Israel didn't do anything except it reacted.... Whatever Israel has done is the only thing that Israel could have done…. I don't think Israel is violating the human rights charter.… War has its own rules" - and went on to stress the "great pain and anguish" endured by Israeli soldiers as they did what "they have to do." Boasting that he "left them a football stadium," one of Wiesel's agonized Israeli soldiers operating a bulldozer in Jenin later recounted in an interview: "I wanted to destroy everything. I begged the officers…to let me knock it all down, from top to bottom. To level everything…. For three days, I just destroyed and destroyed…. I found joy with every house that came down, because I knew that they didn't mind dying, but they cared for their homes. If you knocked down a house, you buried 40 or 50 people for generations. If I am sorry for anything, it is for not tearing the whole camp down.…I had plenty of satisfaction. I really enjoyed it."

[radsolv]

Is Travel Pod really the place for this kind of discussion? At the very least it should be transferred to the Political Forum,-- which is somewhere I think.

I have read quite a few of Chomsky's books and a couple of Finkelstein's as well as attended talks they have given.

I have also visited Palestine in 2002 and if interested you can read my blog at 'radsolv'.

[icarus]

There's no issue with Anti-semitism here. Chomsky, and Finkelstein are refreshing in that they offer critical analysis, which actually should be expected of any reputable scholar.

Doubting the sanctity of the Israeli nation, or even the justifications for its existence, is not anti-semitism. It is simply realpolitik.

One simply has to look at the UN conference on racism (durban) to see the litany of Israeli atrocities. It is shameful that a group of people so intimate with genocidal behavior, have resorted to reproduce some of it in order to maintain an untenable nation state. In time, the idea of a jewish state will look more and more ridiculous.

Until the displaced palestinians are given redress for the atrocities of the 1940s, the world will continue to see Israel as an occupying force, and people like Ahmaninejad will seem all the more rational for his criticisms, centered around 'where' certain violences took place, and the absurdity of the solutions the US/UK have supported.

[Paul]

I'd love to go to the Amazon. Shame about the touts though.

[joyce0]

I've read some of Norman Finkelstein's work and don't believe he is anti-Semitic. There is a trend in calling anyone who criticizes Israeli foreign policy and policies toward the Palestinians anti-Semitic. Essentially, I think the post above is ridiculous.

I agree. People fail to consider all sides of the issue and remember that this issue is more than just an arguement over whose religion is correct. This is an issue that affects people's lives in ways that most Americans could never imagine, whether they are Palestinian or Israeli. The US media and govenment's inability to recognize even the mere existance of Palestine helps to create a nationwide and dangerously subversive bias favoring Israel. There is nothing wrong with being critical of an event, it's better than believing anything anyone tells you.

[fourloves]

I'd love to go to the Amazon. Shame about the touts though.

MUHAHA! Paul, you are great. You make laugh again and again, at times I would never expect. Thanks for that!

radsolv Posted Dec 2 2006, 10:25 PM
Is Travel Pod really the place for this kind of discussion? At the very least it should be transferred to the Political Forum,-- which is somewhere I think.

I think there are still some of us nerds who like this kind of discussion and find it valuable, though it lends itself to flame-posts. If any forum can handle a topic like this is is travelpod. However, I don't want to touch this one with a ten foot pole - it's just sad that we can't have these kinds of discussions without leaving our axe-stones at the door. And do we actually have a political bin? I haven't seen it...

[Paul]

Ha ha - glad you get my strange sense of humour, but I also pity you. Clearly you need to be locked away in the same asylum and with the same medication as me.

Re the discussion. I also agree, I reckon it is good for people to talk about these sorts of things here if they so choose. I chose to leave it alone though (almost) as I think my viewpoints were already covered and I suspect they won't be changing anyone's minds anyway.